Yesterday I called attention to an article written by Jon Katz regarding is opinion about how we care for animals in society today. I got a flood of interesting comments on the blog post and on our Facebook page about it. It is clearly a hot topic.
Honestly, I didn’t make any statements myself. Instead I paraphrased what Katz said and asked what people thought. An overwhelming majority thought yes, sometimes we are going too far when it comes to protecting animals. I tend to agree.
I am not talking about protecting our OWN animals, although Katz himself takes some stabs at those who spend “ridiculous” amounts of money on veterinary care for their pets. Unlike Katz, I don’t think one can go “too far” when caring for their own pet. There are amazing technologies and products out there meant to help protect and prolong the lives of our pets. Many of these things would have been considered “extreme” even 5 years ago. I think that everyone has the right to choose the most progressive, costly technology available to their pet if they want to or protect them in the way they see fit.
I am talking about how we think other people should treat their pets and the extremes some people go to to make themselves heard and impose their beliefs on others.
I certainly think that some interjection is necessary. I was a very uneducated pet parent once and made a lot of mistakes. I probably needed someone more experienced to point out some of the “improvements” I could make. The treatment of animals today is far better than it was 30 years ago and it’s because people had the guts to speak up. Basic animal rights like not being abused, tortured, starved, drowned, etc are very important rights to protect.
Even the “every individual has the right do what they want with their own pet” thing is tricky. I think society was largely in that place 30 years ago and look how many dog fighting rings there were, were being left chained in the back yard to starve, and who were being beaten on a regular basis. And it all was because the people responsible for doing these things didn’t think it was wrong.
A wise person told me once, “People generally don’t do what they think is wrong.”. People doing “wrong” things have justified it in their mind somehow or truly don’t feel it was wrong in the first place. I don’t think they should be let to go about their “bad” business under the premise that people should not interfere with their rights.
Those are extreme cases but I believe there are less extreme cases that might also warrant outside interference. For example, a dog locked in a hot car that is showing clear signs of distress or has collapsed. I do believe that someone has the right to call the police and give the owner a stern talking to. The keys here though are HOT car and CLEAR DISTRESS. I am glad the message is getting out about dogs in hot cars but some people have taken that to mean “any dog in any car”.
For example, I left Chester and Gretel in the car the other day when it was “hot”.
I stopped to get a burger with my husband on the way back from a hike. It was maybe pushing 75 degrees and dogs were not allowed on the patio. We had been driving for a while with the AC blasting and I knew my well-insulated car would stay cool for the 20 minutes that it was parked in the shade.
The car was right next to the patio so we could see all of the windows had the dogs started showing any signs of distress. My husband checked on them several times while we were eating. They slept the majority of the time.
Eventually a gentleman on the patio asked, “Do you want me to call the cops?” I assumed he thought we were good Samaritans worried about the dogs and responded, “Oh, those are our dogs. They are fine”. It was then clear what he was saying was, “I see you left your dogs in the car when the sun is out. You are a lousy pet owner and I am going to call the cops on you” when he continued to make negative remarks to us about it.
I assured him that it was still cool in the car. He said, “If it’s so cool then why aren’t you sitting in there with them?” When I tried to lighten the conversation by making a joke about Chester trying to rip my face off to get to the burger if I sat in there, he told me that I was irresponsible. When I explained to him that I am a hyper-vigilant pet owner and would never put them in danger, he continued to berate me under his breath.
I ignored him and he eventually left but the situation made me feel uneasy. However, I thought it was a good indicator that the message is getting out to the general public about leaving dogs in hot cars. Although I thought he could have been more polite, and let it go when I pointed out that my dogs were in no way in distress, he had every right to ask me and I am glad he felt comfortable enough doing so.
Leaving dogs in hot cars to die is a very clear “no-no” and has resulted in many deaths. Some things are more of an opinion though. Take the case of what to feed your dog.
For those few of you who are not aware, there is a very hot debate in the dog-food world about the choice to feed a dog kibble or raw food. There are compelling reasons why to do it, and why not to do it, on both sides.
As a blogger, I live most of my life with Chester and Gretel “in the public eye” for others to scrutinize. A couple of years ago I was transitioning them to grain-free kibble and I wrote about our journey. One particular woman, very passionate about raw feeding, stalked by blog for months. She left me comments, and responded to other comments on my blog, basically saying that we were abusing our animals by choosing to feed them kibble (a few times she literally said that too). She was relentless and her aggressiveness increased as things went on.
I have done enough research on raw feeding vs. kibble to know that it largely comes down to personal preference. At the very least, choosing to feed one over the other is not a sure death sentence. Unlike dogs locked in hot cars, very few have died as the result of feeding one or the other (taking food categories here – not statements about particular foods). Still, many people feel the need to aggressively “inform” people that their choice is the wrong one. Politely educating is one thing but they are clearly trying to force their beliefs on others.
I think it’s important, when trying to “educate” people about their actions, that people take a step back first. Taking a step back helps one make rational decisions instead of act from pure emotion and self-centeredness. It’s not always easy to do but I can say I’ve done way more things I am not proud of in the heat of the moment than ones that were effective, made me feel good, and made a real difference. I think people can step in while still being polite and respectful. Instead of assuming the worst and being forceful, know the message is usually better received when there is some respect and politeness and when more questions are asked to truly understand the situation.
It also comes down to is a person’s definition of “harm”. All people are never going to agree on what that is when it’s in the grey area. Myself, I define harm as imminent death or a high likelihood severe, permanent damage and tend to err on the side of other people’s rights. Some people think that leaving a dog in a car any time is “harmful” because someone could break the window and steal their dog. Some people think that you should never, ever let your dog eat an onion while others don’t panic unless the dog has eaten a lot of them. Some don’t think a dog should be allowed to ride with their head out the window because something might poke their eye out.
In the end, do I think some people are going too far when it comes to animal rights and forcing their beliefs onto others? Yes, some are. If all of the comments I got yesterday about this are any indication, I am not alone. Some people are taking their personal beliefs and pushing them on others. Other people are appropriately speaking up but doing it in a very inappropriate and ineffective ways.
Do I think that people also have the right to speak up when they feel something is wrong or someone is doing harm to their pet? Yes, yes I do. I know if I saw someone abusing their pet or found one about to pass out in a hot car I would definitely step in.
As with everything in life, I think it comes down the particular situation and circumstances.
Flea says
I think that the whole expense thing for our own pets is sometimes taken too far, when the pet is kept alive for the owner’s benefit. It can be a selfish thing. But that’s the owner’s choice, not mine, and it should be an informed choice, made with a good vet.
Your experience with the stranger makes me uneasy. We’re becoming more and more a police state in this country. I get being caring, saving animals from imminent harm. But he was pushing it big time. It’s uncomfortable, and things will escalate.
Jessica Rhae says
I was trying to look on the bright side but I did feel like he was over-stepping his bounds a little. He did have two teenage kids with him so maybe he felt like he needed to set a particular example. Too bad it wasn’t reasonableness 🙂
Amy says
I agree with Flea. That’s why I have such issues with “shaming,” because people jump on a bandwagon without using common sense. People will rather go along with a blanket statement/belief than get hollered down by popular opinion.
Good for you for using common sense and standing up for yourself and what you knew was right for you and your dogs. With you 100%.
Jessica Rhae says
Thanks Amy. It certainly made me think twice but I knew Chester and Gretel were in no danger. I was a bit nervous that I was going to end up justifying myself to a police officer though.
Debbie Reed says
The circumstances you discribe I do not for a moment i believe that Chester and Gretal were in danger I think some people have a Superman mentality and feel the need to save the world regardless of need. I hope you can read more of Katz, his philosophy about the work of dogs is interesting. I would trust you with my boys anytime, you do not know me but there are few people I can say that to. Keep up you good blogging.
Elizabeth says
I think you said it best – that when people feel the need to educate others that they should try to be polite and respectful, instead of rude and forceful.
Imagine how different the conversation could have gone if that guy had worded his concern over your dogs (i.e, are your dogs comfortable in your car, they won’t be too hot?) instead of this flippant remark? Intention and wording needs to be thoughtfully and respectfully expressed if it’s going to be taken seriously.
Jessica Rhae says
That’s a good way to say it too 🙂
Lauren Miller (ZoePhee) says
Yeah, I totally agree with you. 🙂 I’m actually afraid to leave my dogs in the car on a cool day because so many people are out there taking dogs out of cars. My friend left her dog in the car on a 65 degree day and had the cops called on her. It’s ridiculous. The dog was fine. People can be so crazy.
Jay, Sparking Synapse says
I’ve never had a problem with someone coming to me and expressing concern about one of my dogs. OK, sometimes I feel a bit irritated if the comment is a stupid one, but I don’t think I’ve ever been aggressive or unpleasant with my answer. I think people should be encouraged to speak up if they truly think there is abuse or injustice, so I try to make the answer educational. I have been short with people, but – I think – never outright rude. And if people choose not to listen to a comment of mine, that is their privilege. I reserve the right to call someone if I really, honestly believe there is abuse, but so far I haven’t had to do that.
And it usually does make me think about the situation and wonder if I am right, or if the person has a point. The trouble is, with greyhounds, people are so used to seeing fat, unfit dogs, that they assume my dogs are starved. I must admit, that does get a bit old.
Jessica Rhae says
That sounds very reasonable to me.
Also, I get tired of the same comments over and over about Chester and Gretel’s weight too. Especially because, as you know, they are ones that are misinformed about what the breed should look like. I also try and offer a polite response to questioning and try to use it as a learning opportunity for both of us. I think it’s always good to question our beliefs any time we are presented with new information or a different perspective. When my patience runs thin, I usually just give short response and move on.
Jay, Sparking Synapse says
Are you saying that people are telling you they are too thin? Chester and Gretel are really nice, fit little dogs!! We have a Dachshund lady in the village, she usually has at least three. Her dogs are fit-not-fat, too – but she’s a feisty old lady and will certainly … uh .. give out a lot of accurate information if anyone gets silly with her! I only wish I could be a witness!
Jessica Rhae says
Yeah, not everyone but enough. If they aren’t outright telling me they are too thin, they are asking if they are sick. That I don’t mind so much because at least it opens up the conversation about healthy weight. I have also had people ask because they are genuinely concerned that one of them was sick or something. I can appreciate the concern.
Chester was a bit think for a while. It was like old man thin – he just shrunk one day. Now we have a tad of the opposite problem but I am adjusting his food.
That lady sounds like one I would like to meet too 🙂
Jay, Sparking Synapse says
If people persist, I usually tell them that my vet thinks their weight is perfect and ask them what their vet thinks of their dog’s weight.That’s when I’m starting to get annoyed and a little bit … I don’t know … pointed or blunt, perhaps!
MelF says
Well said Jess. I think the fact that more people are educated about the dangers of leaving a dog in a hot car is good. Taking it to the extreme’s is a problem.
I also remember the high-end kibble vs. low-end kibble debate when I first started blogging. I have come to believe that everyone must do what is right for them. Some people just cannot afford the high-end stuff. For me, raw is just outside my budget. Three dogs of my own and a foster dog in tow means a lot of money if I go raw. My first Sheltie lived to be 15 and she ate the cheapest stuff on the shelf. It was many years ago, but it is a good reminder that not every dog will die if they eat low-end dog food.
Very thoughtful piece. I hope people will share it. Thanks for starting a discussion that was long overdue.
Jessica Rhae says
Thanks Mel. I guess maybe the conversation was overdue huh? I know, personally, I thought I was kind of alone in my opinion… so I was scared that everyone would come out of the woodwork and blast me. I found just the opposite.
Thanks for the heads up on that post. I did email Amy so maybe there will be more about this subject coming 🙂
Jen Gabbard says
It’s so hard to say, I think it all comes down to perspective. There are certainly things I wouldn’t do for the sake of animals, yet I can’t bring myself to judge others who will and go that extra mile.
There have been so many issues when it comes to animal welfare that get debated back and forth, and many of them are heartbreaking. How can I fault someone whose willing to spend thousands of dollars to save his pet? How can I judge someone who spends their spare time rescuing “non-adoptable” pets from shelters?
As with any other interest there seems to be your fair share of know it alls in the pet world. Those who will always believe their way is the best, and anything else is just plain wrong. As Mel pointed out above there’s arguments about kibble that unfortunately alienate a lot of people. I admire people that feed raw but I’m not about to judge anyone that doesn’t. Oh and don’t even get me started on the vaccination debate…
It’s a fine line, but at the end of the day how can I tell someone that’s extremely dedicated to whatever-the-cause that they’re just wrong?
Jessica Rhae says
I feel the same way. That is precisely why I try not to judge.
That goes for the great lengths people go to for animals as well as those who don’t live up to my standards (as long as their is no serious harm being done). Everyone has a different perspective and , although feeling the freedom to speak up is important, I don’t think people have the explicit right to cross boundaries to push their belief on people. That goes for anything in life as far as I am concerned.
I suppose I am judging a little here though – judging those people that alert authorities when they see any pet, any time, left in a car as “over the top” and “going to far”. Like their opinion it’s their duty to due so, it is just my opinion that it isn’t. It’s all very tricky but I think the best approach is to be more understanding of others and their beliefs while being open but firm about yours. Unfortunately, “can’t we all just get along” is not working. I am happy to see a conversation about this issue.
Jen says
Wonderful follow up Jessica! It’s funny how we sometimes think we’re alone in our thoughts but then find out we are not alone! I’m just tired of the finger pointing and cruel judgement. We don’t all have to have the same beliefs but we can be respectful when they are not our own.
Jessica Rhae says
Truth 🙂
cece says
People are crazy about this “”no no poison”” food stuff, I bit a grape in half and ruby ate the other half. A woman jumped at me yelling, you are giving her poison, my vet says one grape will kill them.. I said a cup of them will give them the poops just like you. Same person said if I fed a horse 2 apples and 2 carrots a week, it would develop diabetes in 2 months.. when the hell did that idea start? I worked for a vet, and have vets as friends, all said feed name brand food, dry is better, the bigger pieces the better, they have to chew and it prevents choking. I asked what is the most things you have removed from a dog’s stomach that will hurt them..tennis balls, carpet, rocks, animal hooves, and pig ears.. all will not digest. Not bones, either cooked or raw, they digest in the dogs stomach acid. Hey also when did this idea start that all canned food was better for dogs and cats? I hear that from friends, their vet said all canned, soft food. Sounds like propaganda for teeth cleaning.
Jessica Rhae says
Ugh. The bones. Here is a little story for you.
One day Gretel’s stomach was bloated really bad. I rushed her to the emergency vet. It wasn’t torsion bloat so they they just induced vomiting. She upchucked everything. The only thing the vet found to question was the white, rubbery pieces. She scolded me for feeding my dog rawhide and said that it could have caused a blockage. I said that I have never given my dog rawhide. Ever. She insisted that is what it was and that a neighbor must have thrown some over the fence. I insisted that wasn’t possible and then remembered I had given her a raw rib bone the day before and she bit off of a couple of pieces. It turned out that the white, rubbery pieces were partially digested raw bone. A blockage can always occur no matter how “digestible” something is but there is my proof that a dog’s stomach acid does break the bone down.
By the way, $1,800 later we discovered she was bloated because she had somehow gotten into a loaf of bread and practically at the whole thing! Stinker.
cece says
Almost a whole loaf of bread…ha ha. An aussie I had once ate 5# of dog food in a sitting. He left three pieces on the bottom of the container, perhaps he thought, she not notice some more is gone
Kari says
I got a little temperature gauge from Banfield Pet Hospital that turns orange when it’s too hot in the car. I find it useful, because here in the PNW, we can usually get away with leaving our dogs in the car in the shade with the windows open. But I’m paranoid too, that someone is going to steal my dogs because they think no dog should be left in a car for any length of time ever!! So I hope, in addition to raising awareness, the temperature thing can let people know that actually, it’s not too hot for my dogs in the car.
Jessica Rhae says
I got one of those at the Seattle Pet Expo. I have no idea what temperature it “goes off” at though. I am thinking of buying a cheap thermometer with big, visible numbers to hang in there.
Paige Junge says
I’ve been having a mini-guilt trip about my puppy on what to feed her. Dry? Wet? Grain-free? I chose to go with Taste of the Wild, grain-free, dry, but not insanely expensive.
My cat eats Friskie’s – HIS choice, not mine – because he likes to get UTI’s with dry food.
With a new house, new dog, and a teacher’s salary, I’m trying to find the best for my pets’ health and budget. It bugs me when people say we “have” to do something, something usually expensive. It is not only insulting to my ability to care for my pets, but also an indirect insult to my socio-economic status. Yet I don’t like to say that out loud because then people chime in, “If you can’t afford X super pricey food, how can you afford to even have a dog?”
Stop already!
Luckily, I have auto-start on my car, so if Ramona Pup is along for the ride, and I need to make a quick stop, I can crank the air, lock the doors, and do autostart to leave her nice and comfy. Now will I be chastised for making her too cold with the A/C?
Jessica Rhae says
Who knows. I am begging to thing that there is no winning. Someone will always find a reason to be upset if they want to. What bugs me is that the judgey comments come from a place where the “offender” believes that their beliefs are truth and that they are better judges of your pets and your life than they are
Ann Staub says
This is a great post Jessica. I don’t think I could have said anything you did any better. 🙂 When I was working at the vet clinic, some of my co-workers could be very judgmental of our clients. And I was too at first. It took a few years before I learned that you can never judge someone, because you just don’t know their situation. All we can do is try to help and educate on topics that we find important.
Larry says
Hi Jess,
Really a great discussion, thank you for a great contribution! I think part of the problem lies in the fact that the step back you refer to isn’t something our culture openly teaches. Generally for dog in a hot car media coverage there is an emotional hook to draw in the reader/viewer and then a “call 911” because going into the greater detail might lessen the emotional impact of the story and a very well-intentioned message might get completely lost as the details play out. The good is that it brings the subject to people’s attention and makes them want to act. The downside is that there often isn’t a referral to good resources where a better discussion of what to do next can be found. The “step back” and consider the topic and situation more carefully isn’t even hinted at. That step is what truly gives us the power to live outside of the limbic system of our brains and invent such concepts as justice, tolerance, empathy and forgiveness. Okay, off the soap box. And just to make sure I’m not being a hypocrite I wanted to share the best discussion on what to do for the dog in a car that I’ve come across yet. Find it here: http://www.preventivevet.com/hot-happens-fast. Thanks again!
Jessica Rhae says
Thanks Larry. I think it’s great if there was an open discussion about it. I understand though that a lot of people still down’t even know it’s an issue. I guess you have to start somewhere and make people understand that leaving a dog in a hot car is a dangerous thing to do.